[Colwood] Skye & Capital City Centre condos, offices, commercial | 16- to 29-storeys | Under Construction

[aastra]

The city must measure Astoria's height from the Fairfield Road side? I don't see how else it could end up shorter than View Towers. It looks to be quite a bit taller than the Executive House:



Methinks it would be a good idea to temper the enthusiasm re: towers at Colwood Corners until at least one of the towers actually happens. The west comms are 0 for a bunch so far when it comes to highrises. Although you would never know it from the local media coverage.

[Fairbanks]

Originally Posted by aastra

The city must measure Astoria's height from the Fairfield Road side? I don't see how else it could end up shorter than View Towers. It looks to be quite a bit taller than the Executive House:



Methinks it would be a good idea to temper the enthusiasm re: towers at Colwood Corners until at least one of the towers actually happens. The west comms are 0 for a bunch so far when it comes to highrises. Although you would never know it from the local media coverage.

FYI, the cities of Colwood and Langford have had 10 projects cancelled or placed on-hold since the recession hit. The cities of Victoria and Saanich also had 10 projects suffer the same fate, 8 of which were in Victoria and 2 in Saanich.

http://vibrantvictoria.ca/construction-projects-list/

We may have not been building highrises but housing construction overall in the Westshore is booming....there's no denying that mate.

People who live in glass houses...

[Mike K.]

^I think aastra is speaking only about highrises and how the media portrays the westshore as highrise friendly and soon to take over the core, but in reality not a single highrise building has yet to be built despite years of attempts and media coverage.

Since the early 2000's nearly two dozen towers have been canceled in the westshore.

[aastra]

(this was my reply to Fairbanks, not Mike K.)

I think you might misunderstand me. I'm looking forward to these buildings just like I was looking forward to Silkwind and the rest (well, not Soaring Peaks). But the local media has tended to set the west comms up for disappointment and embarrassment by acting like an approved proposal for a major building is just as solid as a finished building. It hasn't turned out that way, as we've seen now in many instances.

In the city the pundits will doubt a project right up to the day of completion. We saw that with Shoal Point, we saw that with the arena, we saw that with the Hudson reno, we saw that with 834 Johnson... even though the majority of major buildings proposed for downtown eventually get completed. Meanwhile, Finlayson Reach at Bear Mountain is (I think) the only major building that's been completed in the west comms.

[Fairbanks]

Thanks you for your explaination aastra but even after all that is said, it still goes that everyone feels the pinch of these hard times. THe Hudson Walk, etc is in a state of limbo and is currently a hole in the ground and has been for 3 years.

Just up the street from the Hudson is another hole that has been there so long I cant even remember what the project was called.

Then another... Dockside Green? - oh right...that's Esquimalt...not Victoria.

Lots of fanfare from the City over this project and what is it's status?

Look at how far behind schedule the Oak Bay Beach Hotel is. Yes it's being finished now but that was supposed to be done 2 years ago. Oh right that's not Victoria either...that's Oak Bay and we know that there is a huge expanse of land between Victoria and Oak Bay.



So if you want to talk about the media overblowing developments in Greater Victoria then do so but remember these talking points I mention above. Media hype is everywhere.

[Sparky]

Originally Posted by Fairbanks

Just up the street from the Hudson is another hole that has been there so long I cant even remember what the project was called.

Radius

[Fairbanks]

My point is

Greater Victoria is a band of 13 colonies all tied together by the CRD. What affects one colony affects all the colonies. Where do you think the bulk of the construction workers commute from everyday...the Westshore.

If you said the Westshore then you would be correct.

When project goes tits up in the BIG City it affects all of the outlying reaches as well. No work, no money, no money too buy gifts, groceries, clothes, toys, cars, etc.

We are all trying to crawl out of this economic mess.

Nothing worth having should ever come easy.

[Sparky]

I travelled by the League project in Colwood today.

The excavators were in full swing. Nice to see. I hope it continues.

In the big picture, there is a ton of retail oriented construction on the books at present.

[jonny]

I don't quite understand wha Fairbanks is going on about, but aastra makes a good point.

While there are high rise proposals in Victoria that have either not panned out or been placed on hold, I think the city is still batting a respectable average. With construction of the Mondrian, Promontory and Sovereign underway, and the Era (maybe Jukebox too) coming soon, there is quite a bit of high density development happening in the city. On the other hand, there have been many high rise proposals in the West Comms that have gone nowhere.

Personally, I'll believe that there's going to be a 26 story condo tower out in Colwood when I actually see it under construction.

[Mike K.]

Then another... Dockside Green? - oh right...that's Esquimalt...not Victoria.

That's still Victoria. Esquimalt doesn't start for quite a ways in.

I'm always surprised by how many people don't know that the other side of the harbour is not Esquimalt.

On the other hand, there have been many high rise proposals in the West Comms that have gone nowhere.

Or to put it differently, not a single highrise proposal on the westshore has gone anywhere.

Here's a list off the top of my head for failed highrise proposals:

4 x Capella (Langford)
2 x Bear Mountain (two real proposals that were marketed, others were part of the plan but never marketed) (Langford)
2 x The Michelle (Colwood)
1 x Station Ave condo (Langford)
1 x Sooke Rd condo (Colwood)
1 x Triangle Mountain condo (Colwood)
5 x Olympic View condos (Metchosin [recently canceled])
1 x 2771 Jacklin seniors residence (stale proposal, likely canceled) (Langford)
1 x Silkwind (Colwood)
1 x Wale Rd condo (Colwood)
1 x Wilfert Rd condo (Colwood)
2 x Jacklin @ Sooke condos (built as 4-storey buildings) (Colwood or Langford)

And there are others that do not immediately come to mind.

[aastra]

Just in case anyone thinks I'm bashing Langford/Colwood, I'm merely reminding us not to count our chickens before they hatch. I remember when we all first learned of that old Royal Roads tower proposal, we were really interested in it. It seems like a lifetime ago now.

The Royal Roads Place thread reveals just how fed up everyone was with the "phantom highrise" saga by May of 2009 (at that point the saga was already 3 or 4 years old):

Dylan Leblanc posted the following:

I'll buy a drink for the guy who can build the westshore's first highrise

Lover Fighter replied with this:

I was sure surprised when I saw this tower in the paper again today. It was like a ghost from the past.

Phil McAvity observed:

The WestComms still have yet to prove themselves in the skyscraper arena because so far it's been nothing but plans, drawings, meetings and hot air.

vicbc250 was throwing cold water around:

this will never happen nor will any other highrise on the westshore...

I disagree with vicbc250. I have no doubt that suburban highrises will eventually be built. But I sure won't be calling the first tower at Colwood Corners done until it's actually done.

[Fairbanks]

Excavation continues. 2nd set of buildings now gone. Farmer Const is in the process of erecting a site office on Jerome Road. Once this trailer is in place demolition of 3rd building will commence. There is a ton of water in the "hole". I imagine they will have to pump this out as waiting for natural drainage could take a while.

[Fairbanks]

HAZCO

http://www.ccscorporation.ca/

HAZCO is on site and work has ground to a halt. I also noticed about 3 dozen hazardous material barrels on site the other day which are now gone. However, HAZCO crew is still there so they have uncovered some chemical polution. Maybe drycleaning solvents or maybe there was a gas station here once upon a time and the soil is contaminated.

[Wally]

That is going to sting. Contamination issues can be a real pain to address. I don't recall a gas station ever being there.

Thanks for the updates bud

[renthefinn]

I believe there was dry cleaning there for some time though, correct me if I'm wrong. Trichloroethelyne used (or in the past, not sure if they still use it) in dry cleaning can cause some issues.

[Henry Longmire]

Surely, they carried out environmental studies on the site before they bought the property, thats commercial real estate 101. A phase III study would have revealed this issue then, not now when it can cost millions and cause delays of years. This type of blunder questions the knowledge and experience of the developers. The cost of remediation plus the cost of carrying expensive financing for a long period can crush a project.

[sdwright.vic]

Originally Posted by Henry Longmire

Surely, they carried out environmental studies on the site before they bought the property, thats commercial real estate 101. A phase III study would have revealed this issue then, not now when it can cost millions and cause delays of years. This type of blunder questions the knowledge and experience of the developers. The cost of remediation plus the cost of carrying expensive financing for a long period can crush a project.

They developer did not do this for Port Place in Nanaimo, why would they do it here? Tore down half a shopping mall before they found out their was a dry cleaner their in the '60's, then the development stored because they had no money for remediation.

[Sparky]

Henry, we may have missed welcoming you to the forum.

So welcome. I just re read your "tide goes out" post. Funny.

[Fairbanks]

Local barber told me yesterday that there was a gas station on the site years ago so that may be part of the issue.

[Fairbanks]

How does one determine if there is a leak in a pipe that is buried 10 or 12 feet down.

[Fairbanks]

Originally Posted by sdwright.vic

They developer did not do this for Port Place in Nanaimo, why would they do it here? Tore down half a shopping mall before they found out their was a dry cleaner their in the '60's, then the development stored because they had no money for remediation.

Uptown Shopping Centre did exactly that. Tore down half a mall then built phase 1. Then they tore down the second half and are building phase 2. There was a gas station on the site before Moorguard started demolition and the site was cleaned up before construction begain.

[bluefox]

Originally Posted by renthefinn

I believe there was dry cleaning there for some time though, correct me if I'm wrong. Trichloroethelyne used (or in the past, not sure if they still use it) in dry cleaning can cause some issues.

Definitely used TCE in the past, now they use a slightly less carcinogenic chemical, something called PERC (perchloroethylene), unless you go to one of these increasingly popular chemical-free dry cleaners.

Which you should anyway, as even trace amounts of TCE and PERC both stay in your clothes for over a year after the actual dry-cleaning.

[Henry Longmire]

Originally Posted by Fairbanks

How does one determine if there is a leak in a pipe that is buried 10 or 12 feet down.

By carrying out an environmental study on the property BEFORE you commit to buying it. Normal process for professionals in acquiring commercial properties to make sure their investors are not stuck with remediating someone else's problem. As I said before any experienced developer would not make such a stupid mistake.

Of course I am surprised that this land that is worth over $10,000,000 per acre would have the audacity to actually be contaminated.

Sparky thanks for the welcome and recognition.

[Coreyburger]

MoE has a list of sites that may or may not be contaminated.

[Henry Longmire]

Originally Posted by Coreyburger

MoE has a list of sites that may or may not be contaminated.

All sites should be assumed to be contamiated unless proved otherwise.

Thats why financial institutes insist on Phase III reports on anything they fund.

Begs the question, 14 acres without contamination maybe $14 m, with contamination... nightmare! $150m, ... delusion.

But what was paid to buy it, has that been established?