Tax and spending cuts needed in City of Victoria now

[Gregory Hartnell]

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Last year, when I ran for the Concerned Citizens' Coalition as their candidate for mayor of the City of Victoria, I advocated tax cuts as my number one priority.

Implicit in the call for tax cuts was an understanding that superfluous spending at City Hall should also come down, but I admit now that that was not explicitly stated in my campaign literature.

It should have been, and I now admit my error. We have only to look south of the border at the havoc to the American economy wreaked by George Bush's tax cuts which have not been balanced by prudent spending cuts to see the folly of this.

Here is a quote from my ten point 'Recovery Plan Victoria' which I submit to the readers here for historical perspective, and to stimulate debate:

"1. Tax Cuts: to help first-time home buyers, particularly young families new to the real estate market, and to stimulate the depressed downtown economy. Lower residential and commercial property taxes in the City of Victoria."

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[NMP]

Could you provide more details to spending cuts? What, where, how much?

[Holden West]

People are always clamouring for tax cuts but when presented with a list of expenditures and asked specifically what they would cut they usually clam up or call for cutting insignificant or symbolic amounts (like politician's salaries, which constitutes a tiny fraction of a government's budget).

[m0nkyman]

Municipalities are usually underfunded. I'll support pretty much any and all federal tax cuts, but oppose cutting taxes to municipalities.... and this from a guy who just got dinged with a two thousand dollar municipal property tax increase....

[Gregory Hartnell]

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I believe we are wasting about $2,100,000 a year making payments on the new arena. Far from being a building that would cost Victoria taxpayers $30,000,000, as Alan Lowe indicated when he campaigned for his bogus referendum on the issue, this ugly structure will really cost us about $63,000,000 over the thirty years of the contract with RG Properties. Sell it for no less than $40,000,000.

I would also try to have the Council negociate with CUPE to lower their expectations in terms of wage demands. Exhorbitant labour costs are a huge part of the City's budget, and need to be reduced.

With the poplulation of the City of Victoria static, or diminishing, as I believe is also the case now, a staff hiring freeze would also seem to be in order, at least until such time as a new poplulation influx would warrant new staff hiring.

I emphasize that I am talking only about the City of Victoria, which despite the growth of highrise buildings built mainly for real estate speculation, is actually economically decadent compared to the real growth occuring in the Western Communities.

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[Mike K.]

Mr. Hartnell, with respect to your comment: "...highrise buildings [in Victoria are] built mainly for real estate speculation," is that a rumour or is that a fact? You've previously taken issue with a piece of hearsay posted on this forum and warned that hearsay and rumours will hurt the credibility of VibrantVictoria. With that being the case, could you supply us with a reference to back up your claim?

Furthermore, the population of the City of Victoria is on a healthy rise according ot the CRD [url=http://crd.bc.ca/regionalplanning/facts/population/documents/POPGROW_06.pdf#view=Fit:ba805](here)[/url:ba805], even with the supposed speculative real-estate purchases.

[zoomer]

Originally Posted by Gregory Hartnell

I would also try to have the Council negociate with CUPE to lower their expectations in terms of wage demands. Exhorbitant labour costs are a huge part of the City's budget, and need to be reduced.

With the poplulation of the City of Victoria static, or diminishing, as I believe is also the case now, a staff hiring freeze would also seem to be in order, at least until such time as a new poplulation influx would warrant new staff hiring.

As Derf has pointed out, the population of Victoria is not static or diminishing (73,504 in 1996 to 80,380 in 2006). I would expect a candidate for the mayor's chair to know this basic information about his city. Highrises built mainly for real estate speculation?? Can you explain that to me? Every single highrise built in the city has completely sold out--maybe do you think they are being built because people actually want to live in the city of Victoria?!

Also, please note that the Council does not negotiate with Cupe directly as you have suggested. "lower their expectations in terms of wage demands"?! Seriously, can you even tell me what the average wage increase has been for City of Victoria workers over the past decade? Compared to the average wage increase in Canada? Compared to cost of living increases in Canada? Didn't think so.

I really think you need to do your research before announcing your positions. Out of curiousity, how many votes did you receive in the last election?

[captain highliner]

381, as compared to 8,690 for Lowe and 7,298 for Isitt.

[Gregory Hartnell]

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I note with interest that most commentators don't address the main issue of the thread, which is whether or not taxes should be lowered, kept static or rise.

Only Munkyman likes paying more taxes, which I find strange, but at least he is candid about it.

As for the CRD, I scoff at their authority, noting that they are completely unaccountable and irresponsible. I cite the scandalous sewage issue as just one example.

The last thing the City needs is another layer of non-elected and non-accountable government churning out reports on regional growth which not a single government (not even the Highlands) in the area abides by. Perhaps the only exception is Metchosin...

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[G-Man]

Actually I do not mind paying taxes so long as I feel I am getting good value for them. I have yet to feel ripped off.

[Holden West]

There is no living human being that would like to pay more taxes than required to run a sustainable city.

I'd love it if my taxes went down.

But I ask again...where do we cut? Getting rid of the CRD is another topic altogether. Lord knows we gripe about the CRD here on this site. It could be modified of course but eliminating it and assuming this would result in noticeable lower taxes is wishful thinking.

[Caramia]

I don't pay enough municipal taxes so I volunteer at City run events to make up for the difference.

(only half tongue in cheek)

[Scaper]

Commenting on the U.S. economy....right now the U.S. has an unemployment rate of 4.4 percent...in down from 5.8 percent in March or 03......the U.S. economy is doing really well....depends where you get your news.....

http://www.cbc.ca/money/story/2006/11/0 ... ssoct.html

The unemployment rate in the United States fell to a five-year low of 4.4 per cent in October with the addition of roughly 92,000 new jobs.

However, last month's job creation came in far short of the 125,000 new positions that Wall Street economists had been projecting.

The U.S. Labour Department said October's unemployment was down from 4.6 per cent and was the lowest monthly rate recorded since the 4.3 per cent seen in May 2001.

With the U.S. Federal Reserve keeping a close watch for inflation pressures, the government reported that workers' average hourly earnings climbed to $16.91 US in October, a 0.4 per cent increase from September. The increase surpassed the 0.3 per cent rise economists had been forecasting.

The October job growth figures are one of the last pieces of economic data to be released before the U.S. mid-term elections take place on Nov. 7.

[Galvanized]

Originally Posted by Gregory Hartnell

Here is a quote from my ten point 'Recovery Plan Victoria' which I submit to the readers here for historical perspective, and to stimulate debate:

"1. Tax Cuts: to help first-time home buyers, particularly young families new to the real estate market, and to stimulate the depressed downtown economy. Lower residential and commercial property taxes in the City of Victoria."

Originally Posted by Gregory Hartnell

I note with interest that most commentators don't address the main issue of the thread, which is whether or not taxes should be lowered, kept static or rise.

I'm not sure why you started this thread and then refuse to back up your argument for lowering taxes by deflecting direct questions with "I note with interest that most commentators don't address the main issue of the thread". There were specific questions in regards to how you back up your claims in your 2nd post on this page. Then you cloud the issue of the City of Victoria by bringing up the CRD which is not the main issue of this thread as you stated. Do you have a more detailed plan of your own or are you looking to rip off ideas from other forumers to add to your platform? The topics you create on this forum are beginning to look like spam for your political campaign.

Anyways, I live in Saanich and I miss the much lower taxes I paid in the City of Victoria.

[renthefinn]

Unemployment is at like 3.5% in Victoria right now right? I thought the US economy was getting worse (according to my interpretation of the Economist, with their housing market softening and their increased debt to GDP ratio, not to mention the lack of consumer spending) am I missing something. Maybe the recent trend to avoid interest rate increases has turned the page for the US economy?

[Walter Moar]

Tax cuts in order to help first time buyers? Do you even realize what an insignificant amount property tax is, compared to home prices and the interest paid on a mortgage?

As with everyone, I would gladly pay less taxes. However, I would also gladly pay more taxes if it went to the right place. More property tax going to transit and infrastructure? Yes. And, as stated in another thread, I'd love to see a $0.25 per litre gas tax that goes directly to transit, bike lanes, LRT, etc.

[G-Man]

The best way to help first time buyers I think is to increase the housing stock. Throw in some government built affordable housing projects and lower capital taxes on rental construction projects.

[captain highliner]

In my opinion it's the hidden costs of excessive land use regulations that need to be adressed by the city. To simply call for tax cuts in the absence of hard data is nothing more than a cheap vote grab. Good thing the voters don't always buy it.

I would prefer to see more decentralization of public service delivery and taxation powers to the municipal and regional level, so that programs could better respond to the individual needs of citizens in their region. More experimentation and diversity in service delivery models is desperately needed.

The federal government, through such things as the sponsership program and the long gun registry has shown its self to be far more reckless with our money than the city of Victoria.

That being said, I'm no anarchist. I do see a role for the higher levelsd of government in areas like the administration of justice and income redistribution at the inter-regional level. I guess it's more about tax shifting than cuts per se.

If through some act of collective insanity we elected a CCC city council, I would hate to see the effects that ideologically based tax cuts combined with a social conservative agenda would impose on our community.

[Baro]

City taxes are so small that even outright eliminating them would hardly help anyone. Maybe they'd buy a better spread at someone's house warming party, that's about it.

What CAN effect pricing is supply and demand. Victoria has SO much demand and so little supply, and it doesn't take an economics major to figure out what that will do for prices.

People against normal sized developments (see 'highrises') are simply against change, or simply against buildings for purely emotional or ignorant reasons. The fear of change and the ignorance of the actual mechanics of how a city runs comes at a high price though, the two biggest being spawl and housing prices only those with very deep pockets can afford.

I know some people, even some political candidates would gladly pay those costs simply for their own selfish "piece of mind" knowing that some compleatly arbitary height or density hasn't been reached in the city. That, or they ignore or don't believe that there's actually a conection between the housing stock available in the city and the housing stock built via sprawl. But anyone who truely cares about the city can see that density and height are a small small 'price' to pay for a vibrant healthy city.

But then again, that's all just speculation.

[Phil McAvity]

I'm all for tax and spending cuts, because i'd really like to see a LOT less meddlesome, useless, micro-managing bureaucrats and lawyers at City Hall and the CRD, the only problem is, that the province largely controls the amount of money that the city spends, and they obviously care little about this issue.